The Fog of War, the movie that finally won Errol Morris the best documentary Oscar, is a spellbinder. Morris interviews Robert McNamara, Secretary of Defense in the Kennedy and Johnson administrations, and finds a uniquely unsettling viewpoint on much of 20th-century American history. Employing a ton of archival material, including LBJ's fascinating taped conversations from the Oval Office, Morris probes the reasons behind the U.S. commitment to the Vietnam War--and finds a depressingly inconsistent policy. McNamara himself emerges as--well, not exactly apologetic, but clearly haunted by the what-ifs of Vietnam. He also mulls the bombing of Japan in World War II and the Cuban Missile Crisis, raising more questions than he answers.
The Fog of War has the usual inexorable Morris momentum, aided by an uneasy Philip Glass score. This movie provides a glimpse inside government. It also encourages skepticism about same.
--Robert Horton
1 On Oral History and the Power of Memory
I don't hand out five-star ratings lightly, and for a documentary to boot! Yes, this film won an Oscar¨ for documentaries, but awards don't mean as much to me as they once did. In fact, I watched this film in a bit of a vacuum, before learning of its award-winning status. And it was simply a compelling narrative on multiple levels.
Robert McNamara came into the public eye as one of, if not the youngest assistant professors at Harvard and played an integral part in the intelligence leading to America's fire-bombing of Tokyo in World War II. After the war, he became the first non-Ford family member to become president of the automobile giant, only to be snatched up almost immediately by JFK to serve as his Secretary of Defense. That position put him in the inner sanctum for America's cold war era, through the Vietnam war.
This documentary is essentially an extended interview with the 85-year-old McNamara, intercut with film clips and taped conversations from the news stories ranging across his career. One would expect McNamara to use the platform as a justification for his positions and actions throughout the last six decades, but in fact, he's alarmingly candid about his errors in judgment and where he believes America's foreign policy (then and now) has been flawed. The film is arranged around Eleven Lessons that McNamara has gleaned from his experiences.
I'm not a big documentary fan, and my history background isn't extensive enough to make cohesive judgments on his interpretations of events, but the simple wealth of memories McNamara includes in the interviews and his wonderful articulation of the back stories makes this film one not to be missed. It's a brilliantly compiled and compelling narrative.
2 Hindsight 20/20 style
A magnificent political documentary which explores the retrospectives and political hindsights of Robert S. McNamara who, in years gone by, was the Rumsfeld of the Vietnam War. Speaking candidly about the lessons he's learned from his experiences of war, McNamara shares his controversial past with us, including a frank discussion about his role in the planning of the WWII firebombing of Japanese cities in order to maximise their destructive efficiency. In one night alone we are told that McNamara's B-29 bomber group burned to death 100,000 men, women and children in downtown Tokyo. Most of this history, plus other political insights on the Cuban Missile Crisis and LBJ's now released tape recordings on the Vietnam War was news to me and I felt that McNamara's war lessons and hindsights should never be underestimated or dismissed. As a matter of fact, there were many instances when the war footage was rolling and McNamara was speaking about the lessons from his life, I found myself wondering just how much wisdom have today's political leaders acquired from studying war failures from America's past? My conclusion having watched the Fog of War is, as you might expect, very little. The faces and the suits have all changed from Washington in the sixties, but the war rhetoric is still very much the same today as it was back then. This is a powerful political documentary and a valuable history lesson and I recommend that you buy it, watch it and Study The Past.
3 Robert S. McNamara's eleven lessons
It's obvious that Robert S. McNamara has a hard time with these interviews. Struggling at times, seeking explanations for LeMays bombings on Japan and for the escalation in Vietnam, occasionally looking like a nervous wreck. Tears in his eyes.
McNamara, once described by Barry Goldwater as an "IBM machine with legs" has an opportunity here in 'Fog of War' to present his case to the public, and he does so with both integrity and honesty. From his early childhood he remembers the victory parade when the First War ended, how he fought to be the most ambitious and brightest student in school, the experiences he had during World War II and how he was offered the top spot at Ford company. JFK offering secretary of defense. Then there is the Cuban Missile crisis 1962. Those fateful 13 days when the world came inches away from nuclear war. Then of course the escalation of the Vietnam War during LBJ...
Those are the subjects and 'Fog of War' goes through it very skillfully. Presenting eleven lessons in the film. What were our successes? Our failures? What is in a sense human nature when faced with political turmoil and crisis on the brink of war, and indeed in times of war. What are we capable of if we examine ourselves?
These lessons are experiences by a man making decisions and giving advice to Kennedy and Lyndon B. Johnson. Simultaneously it casts a shadow on current events in the sense that it can't help but to raise important questions of war and peace today. Questions about US foreign policy in general. That is reason enough to take the time it takes to watch `Fog of War'. It's interesting and thought provoking.
4 fascinating look into the mind of a maverick
i didn't know anything about robert mcnamara when i rented this video, but now I feel like I know enough to fake my way through a dinner party. this is a really insightful look into the mind of a person who played an important role in u.s. history. there's some excellent cinematography and the original score by phillip glass is very good, although no "einstein on the beach". the deleted scenes were also very interesting. definitely worth a rental.
5 A magnificent accomplishment
This is one of the finest documentaries I have ever seen, and Errol Morris is to be commended for having the vision and foresight to record, in full, the McNamara story while it was still possible. It is both enlightening and chilling, far more compelling than some of the trite documentaries that have found their way to the screen in recent years. This is one to watch.
6 Possibly the best of the current crop of documentaries
I liked this better than "Farenheit 911" or any other documentary I have watched in the past ten years. You are getting the facts straight from the horse's mouth, so to speak. Interviewing McNamara: what a golden opportunity. It is refreshing to hear a man speak with so much candor and openness.
7 Obvious Oscar Winner
I thought Capturing the Friedman's should have won the Best Documentary Oscar until I saw Fog of War. If you are thinking about staying home this weekend and want to watch a film that gets you thinking, then Errol Morris' Fog of War is your best bet. Winner of the 2003 Academy Award for best Documentary Feature, Fog of War documents Robert McNamara, U.S. Secretary of State under Kennedy and Johnson, and his recollection of everything from his tenure as President of Ford Motors, to his involvement, as an advisor, in the foreign policy and subsequent standoff of the Cuban Missile Crisis.
Fog of War uses archival and interview footage with McNamara to explain the eleven lessons he learned from his time working as Secretary of State. His political savvy is captured onscreen as he brings the viewers up to speed on some of the historical decisions he helped foster, the results to which saw him become the President of the World Bank.
Fog of War acts as a reminder of the importance of past political decisions in a more comprehensive and constructive way thank Michael Moore is capable of.
8 A Powerful Historical Documentary
I was a young man during the Vietnam war, and I can remember Robert McNamara on television talking about the war. To be honest, I never liked the man at that time. Like many Americans, I grew to believe that the Vietnam war was wrong, and McNamara was one of the main cogs in the war machine.
This documentary puts more of a human face on the man. Yes, he did participate in the planning of the bombing of Japan in WWII, and was Secretary of Defense in the Vietnam war. But his lessons described in the documentary should be taken to heart by all Americans and especially politicians and leaders. In some portions of the film he appears to try and defend his actions, but only with partial success. His eyes and his trembling voice belies the fact that he does hold himself at least somewhat responsible.
For people who are working towards peace, this is a must-see. For people that think war is the answer, it is also a must-see. A wise person once said (to paraphrase) "Whoever doesn't learn from the past is doomed to repeat it". After watching this video and looking at the events of our time, it drives the point home even more.
Watch it, realize that perhaps we are making the same mistakes that this man warns against. Robert McNamara is obviously a very intelligent man. What a waste that so much of that intelligence that could have been used towards the betterment of mankind, had to be used to facilitate the death of so many. That is the lesson that can be learned from this film.
9 Interesting Insights into "Mac the Knife's" mind and life
Robert "Mac the Knife" McNamara gives us a rare glimpse into the mind of the Secretary of Defense that led us into the tragedy of the Vietnam War. He gives an interesting assessment of the Cuban Missile Crisis, when we avoided nuclear war by shear luck, as well as the moral ambiguity behind our raising of Japanese cities in WWII. The eleven lessons he goes through should be considered by those leading us into another war where we are alone and opposed by allies.
The first lesson is "empathize with your enemy" which gave a narrow way out of the Missile Crisis of 1962. He labels the U.S., Castro, and Krushchev as "rational"; very debatable as far as putting missiles in Cuba to begin with, LeMay's desire for war, and Castro's willingness to sacrifice Cuba in a nuclear war for Socialism.
We hear taped conversations of JFK and Mac about Vietnam, and learn of Mac's belief that JFK would NOT have escalated the way Johnson did, Chomsky's views notwithstanding. Mac was fired by LBJ in 1967 and was out of the loop for "Nixon doctrine in its purest form", namely the massive bombing of Cambodia that led to the Khmer Rouge genocide ("The Killing Fields" tells this story well).
LeMay was quite correct: had we lost the war he and Mac would have been executed for war crimes committed in Japan. Mac was complicit in genocide in Vietnam, and with him Hanna Arendt's phrase, "the banality of evil" comes to mind. In hindsight he is haunted by what he's done, but is reluctant to second guess history, or at least to publicly incriminate himself. In the end we get the impression of an ordinary man who reveals a sentimental side as he becomes tearful a few times.
I hope his vision of the future comes to pass: no more war.
That vision he has is a contrast to his actions in Vietnam. Many have learned the lesson of the past. Those in charge of the world now don't seem to be in this group.
10 Re:Out of context and some dubbing detected
I was hoping more would be discussed about the War on Terror and the world today, but other than that this is one of the best documentary's I've seen.
In response to the ridiculous review review by Matthew W. Cero "The Goalie", it should be noted that the movie is "clipped" together because in the beginning of the movie, McNamara talks of hanging sentences and how if he pauses in mid sentence, he will just continue from where he left off.
It should not suprise anyone that parts are "clipped" together because an 85 yr old pauses in mid sentence
As for the claim that 100,000 dead civilians was dubbed in, he may not move his lips but he's sure moving his tongue. He didn't become a ventriloquist at 85!
Some people need to wake up. This movie isn't for partisan hacks.
11 A gem of a documentary
Whatever your views are of Robert McNamara he is certainly engaging, articulate, and spirited in this fascinating and well-crafted Errol Morris film. The discerning viewer will appreciate the attention to detail here with its skillful editing and haunting footage as well as the superb but not overdone Philip Glass soundtrack. Ten years from now, even twenty years from now, it will remain highly watchable.
12 A testimonial from a pivotal historical figure
It is hard to imagine it, but before Donald Rumsfeld, Robert McNamara was the most controversial Secretary of War since Edwin Stanton (FYI, he served under Lincoln).
The reviews all testify to the fact that liberals and conservatives have pro and con views of both the man, and the film which examines what he believes he has learned from two wars and decades of reflection over the consequences. Some of his conclusions are admittedly self-serving, but taken in the context of the current American foreign policy, it is a credible contrast.
McNamara poignantly admits to making mistakes and perhaps questions the morality of those choices. He still tears up when he recalls President Kennedy, and his anguish between loyalty to LBJ and wanting to untangle the mess Vietnam ultimately became reveal an honesty and humanity few public figures exhibit.
The score by Philip Glass adds depth and gravitas to an already somber theme (the brutality and pain of war), and director Errol Morris' use of extreme close-ups and off-kilter editing do much to reveal the pain, and at times desperation with which McNamara seeks to warn us of the potential consequences of our actions. Particular in this regard is his recollection of Tommy Thompson's lone voice of opposition during the Cuban Missile crisis. According to "Mac", it was pure dumb luck that saved us from apocolypse, and if not for a single voice of reason, it is likely that Kennedy would have followed the advice of the Joint Chief's and ordered an invasion of Cuba. Castro later revealed that not only had there been operational warheads on Cuba (which could have killed tend of millions of Americans), but he had advised their use had the US invaded. It begs the question, how would President Bush have handled this crisis, and what would have been the cost? Extrapolation to the current day, and current handling of the war will yield interesting conclusions.
Viewer's may watch this film with pre-conceived notions of who Robert McNamara was, and the long-term effects of his decisions. But as America enters its second year of Iraqi liberation/occupation, few men are more qualified than he is to warn us of the dangers of military/political hubris. It is a timely documentary, and a voice, very much worth listening to.
13 It is obvious why this won the oscar for best doco
If you are thinking about staying home this weekend and want to watch a film that gets you thinking, then Errol Morris' Fog of War is your best bet. Winner of the 2003 Academy Award for best Documentary Feature, Fog of War documents Robert McNamara, U.S. Secretary of State under Kennedy and Johnson, and his recollection of everything from his tenure as President of Ford Motors, to his involvement, as an advisor, in the foreign policy and subsequent standoff of the Cuban Missile Crisis.
Fog of War uses archival and interview footage with McNamara to explain the eleven lessons he learned from his time working as Secretary of State. His political savvy is captured onscreen as he brings the viewers up to speed on some of the historical decisions he helped foster, the results to which saw him become the President of the World Bank.
With the final Presidential Debate taking place this Friday, Fog of War acts as a reminder of the importance of past political decisions in a more comprehensive and constructive way thank Michael Moore is capable of.
14 ** ALL WAR MONGERS SHOULD SEE THIS **
This documentary was out of this world. You get a first hand account of how certain wars in our country's history were decided upon and in some instances bungled with many lives lost... all because of greed, excessive amount of control and lack of simple communication. Robert McNamara ought to be ashamed of himself for what he helped to achieve during his time in the white house ... and judging by how much he cried in the film he is ashamed.
15 It's His Eyes
You end up watching this man, a "talking head," for so long. While there are a handful of shots of him driving what looks like a Ford Taurus past the Pentagon and a number of other government landmarks, almost all footage showing a contemporary Robert McNamara seems to be a single-camera setup.
He is trying to be honest, but does not promise to be self-revelatory. Others here speculate that it is his shot at redemption. If you know his work at Ford, you know that he's not really a redemption kind of guy. Rather, he's more a scientist or engineer. He want's to contribute to a growing body of knowledge. He's [obviously] not afraid to make mistakes, so long as they are cataloged and recorded.
So long as we all learn from them.
That's why he made this film. There are moments of emotion - for example, when he talks about John Kennedy's death. But it's not a confessional. He says more than once, "I'm not going to go into this," because it relates to private matters.
Watch his eyes. Watch how hard it is for him to do what he feels so strongly compelled to do: somehow add meaning to his experiences by teaching us. The pain his eyes express sometimes is at once awful and compelling.
I don't think he made this movie to earn absolution. He's the kind of guy who would claim absolution as a matter of right.
No, he wants us to learn, and to enable that by as much lucidity and honesty as he can muster. Most leaders don't care enough about us to take this effort.
As much as a reasonable person could hate McNamara, I thank him for trying to teach us. It's like hearing someone already in hell trying to offer a word of warning.
16 I'd rather be damned if I don't.
Growing up as a kid on Ft Sam Houston, TX, during the sixties and seventies, I was so enthralled with soldiers and war and guns. I remember the nightly news with Walter Cronkite, always with casualty figures and reports from the front.
What I didn't realize at the time, what I was shielded from, were the number of casualties stuffed in the Brook Army hospital that we drove by every day. All I saw was a beautiful, big brick building; it was innocuous. The Fog of War brought back those insanely wonderful memories.
Watching the Fog of War is like inviting RSMcN to your living room to hear his side of the story. Like him, or revile him, this documentary is candidly enigmatic. At times, you take what he has to say at face value. At others, he reminds you, using one of his lessons, that what is said and what is heard may not necessarily be true. He makes no apologies. He simply states, "Any military commander will tell you that they have made mistakes. It's the Fog of War."
Do not miss the Special Features section; his memory of his comments to a protester at the World Bank is priceless.
What you should know...
[as a veteran of both the first and second American Gulf Wars, as well as the Balkan wars of the 90s, i have to admit i'm biased; war sucks, and i'm a sucker for people who admit that war sucks. knowing this, you should also know that i admire rummy, as he is RSMcN if RSMcN were SECDEF today. If you revile rummy, watch this documentary if only to study your enemy.]
17 Great , edgy documentary of the lie of politics and war
Wow this was a great documentary after watching movies by
Michael Moore I thought he was the only that could present
topics like these but was I wrong. Errol Morris won an Oscar for his work in this movie and it shows.
Its just stunning imaginative, and hard hitting. There are no
lies in the film, no ramblings of a Republican spewing out
propaganda just cold hard fact. Morris interviews Robert McNamara, the former Secretary of Defense in the Kennedy and Johnson administrations and in great interview fashion McNamara
essentially bares his soul to the viewer.
Its not just a documentary buts its a reprieve of sorts for the
guy who has lead and participated in some of the most notorious
coverups and shames in American history from Vietnam to
the Cuban Missile Crisis to World War II.
Morris uses audio tapes captured from then President Lyndon
Johnson and McNamara to show us the sham that was Vietnam.
It wasnt about fighting the cold war people, it was about imposing our colonial ideals on a weaker nation. Just like
we did with the Soviet Union and left that nation in poverty,
there was never any proof they were going to attack us with
Castro, these are just the paranoid beliefs of one President
to the other.
McNamara tells us what we already know, there was no planning
for Vietnam It was a huge mistake that was financed merely
for profit. We were not liberating the Vietnamese, in fact
the Vietnamese did not want our presence.
He mentions the poor military technology that often made
mistakes such as when enemies attacked when they didnt.
He mentions that all his doings have been wrong and it took
many years as it usually does for a narrow minded individual
to wake up to the truth.
The 1995 meeting he had with a former Prime Minister sums
it up "We were not fighting Communism, he says we were
fighting for our Independence".
This is just an awesome film like "FAHRENHEIT 911" that has
to been and seen with a large gathering of people so we can
learn from our mistakes so we dont repeat them.
18 Doomed to repeat history, again?
This was a great film/documentary. It is rare that a layman is able to learn from a master. Like him or not, McNamara was present and made some of the most important decisions mankind ever made. His experience is almost incomprehendible, and what he shares with the viewer will benefit mankind if we actually listen and learn from the lessons of history.
As an example, towards the end of the work, McNamara states that when he met with his Vietnamese counterpart, the officer told McNamara that the fatal flaw was that the US looked at Vietnam as a country which was going to bend over and accept Communism. This view, however, was wrong and the Vietnamese really viewed the conflict as a war against occupiers, beit Chinese or Americans. Hence, McNamara says that one of the lessons is to sympathize with your enemy. Don't feel bad for them, but understand them. If not, you go with the wrong context and face incredibly negative consequences.
Too bad those who took our boys and girls to Iraq, didn't watch "Fog of War" or at least didn't learn from any of the wisdom contained within.
"It's deja vu all over again?"
PS - McNamara's lessons are true for pursuits far removed from the battlefield, but you already knew that, right?
19 Ramblings From the Nation's Worst Secretary of Defense
After listening to the inept, revisionist McNamara ramble on in this film, one wonders what's next -- a documentary from Jimmy Carter on how to be a great president? Step one: create double-digit interest rates. Step two: stand impotent in the face of terrorists holding Americans hostage for 444 days in Tehran...
What a shame America abandoned the people of South Vietnam, who were then steamrolled by the Soviet-backed North Vietnamese army, where millions of South Vietnamese were then murdered in communist "re-education camps," or died while fleeing into the open sea in small boats to escape the communist onslaught from the North.
The film gets two stars because it's at least instructive to observe the failed McNamara flailing about.
20 Kennedy our greatest president?
This is a movie every American must watch. Many of the other reviewers critique McNamara's honesty, and whether he really apologizes for things for which the various reviewers think he needs to apologize (or not), so I won't dwell further there.
To me, the one thing I'm surprised more people don't talk about is the information he shares about what he learned well after-the-fact about the Cuban Missile Crisis. If you believe what RSM says (based on his conversations with Castro), had we invaded Cuba (as all of Kennedy's military advisors strongly advised him to do), they would have launched their already-operational nuclear missiles at the US, and would have killed about 80 million Americans (about 1/3 of the population of the US). That Kennedy refused to consider the military option saved those lives; it seems that simple. If THAT alone doesn't make him our greatest President (for all of his other well-documented failings), I simply don't know what does.
21 A haunting and sobering learning experience!
I saw this film for the first time on DVD about eight months ago and I was completely stunned by it. He was making such sense to me because he was the first person in his position to say in effect that you must accept the consequences of your actions, but at the same time there are moments where he tries to excuse himself from some of his actions and decisions during the WW2 and Vietnam.
He understands the roads that led him to those decisions. Know, with that knowledge and experience, he's offering guidance.
His lessons actually make sense. There's been so many people saying that the White House and the Pentagon should watch this film, and I wholeheartedly agree. I've always believed that if you understand history, you understand what led people in similiar positions to the outcomes. I think the lesson that The White House should be taking notes while watching is "Be prepared to rexamine your reasoning." I don't need or want to explain why.
Brilliantly edited for clarity and understanding, and not for flash. In other words it's not MTV editing, editing because you want to. Excellent score that does what all great scores do, it hightens the emotion and accentutates the drama.
One of the best doc's in any genre.
22 Confessions of a mass murder
This is a great movie that everyone should see. It is not as good as The Trail of Henry Kissinger which is available in book form (but not the movie) from amazon. This movie covers a few events from RSM's life and America's foreign policy handbook.
This DVD has the following factual inaccuracies:
1. RSM never admits the Gulf of Tonkin event was a fraud, and all of the reasons for the war in Vietnam were all B.S.
2. He makes a vague reference to Kennedy and himself "knowing" that the coup in South Vietnam just before Kennedy's death had American support. Everyone knows it was staged by the Central Intelligence Agency.
3. He calls the slaughter of 100,000 civilians during one evening of firebombing the worst massacre in history. While the sum of the millions of people killed in the entire campaign may have been the biggest campaign of genocide ever, it wasn't the biggest single day mass murder. The U.S. killed a quarter of a million innocent people (half a million by some estimates) using the same firebombing tactics in Dresden (a city that had no military value) on February 13, 1945.
4. He says he "can't remember" whether or not he authorized the use of Agent Orange in Vietnam. Sure. This is what scumbag lawyers like Johnny Cochran call the Selective Memory Defense. If you can believe that anyone could forget something that important, you probably believe everything the government tells you.
It's kind of ironic that he cried when he talked about JFK's death. He didn't shed a tear for any of the millions of people that he killed.
In the end though, I think that he was sorry for making this planet a living hell, and I think that now he shares the same dream as every other decent human being:
Hopefully, some day when people extract their heads from their asses we'll stop killing each other.
23 Part documentary, part apology
I don't disagree with the good things most reviewers said about this film. It is intelligently done and includes statements on most of the important sessions in Robert McNamara's life.
However, it is clear from watching this that many of McNamara's perceived "lessons" of war are cast from his own personal guilt over his role in fire bombing Japanese cities in World War II and the foolishness of American involvement in Vietnam beginning in 1964. McNamara clearly is uneasy with his personal history, and that unease has much to say about his "lessons".
Furthermore, I'd have been happier if he's just come out and admitted that the Tonkin Gulf event never happened instead of simply implying such. This was the linchpin event leading to American involvement in Vietnam, after all. It would be good to have on the record, finally, that is never occurred.
The most telling portion of the film is McNamara's description of events surrounding the blockade in Cuba during the so-called Cuban missile crisis. The events McNamara describes were almost perfectly realized by characters in the 1964 film "Fail Safe". For me, this was the most enlightening section of the biograph.
I enjoyed this film but, after reading about it for months, was a bit let down by McNamara's real guilt over events from his life. I found this more of a lesson in McNamaraism than in history, to be honest.
24 One Life, Eleven Lessons, and a Wealth of Wisdom...
Looking into ones own past and recognizing the mistakes that have been made is a sign of wisdom. The director Errol Morris intelligently devises ways to share this wisdom of Robert Strange McNamara, who willingly shares his life lessons with a higher purpose, which is to educate younger generations. McNamara shares 11 of his lessons through verbal recollection and archived films. This cinematic enlightenment covers the time from McNamara's birth to the time of the shooting of the film. However, the film focuses on the time from World War II to his leave of office as United States Secretary of Defense.
Errol Morris, a diligent documentary filmmaker, has made films such as Thin Blue Line (1988), Cheap, Fast, and Out of Control (1997), and Mr. Death: The Rise and Fall of Fred A. Leuchter, Jr. (1999). These films depict stories regarding death row inmates, corrupt systems, eccentric characters, and the electric chair designer. Robert S. McNamara, on the other hand, is known as the former General Manager for the Ford Motor Company, the Vietnam War architect, and the World Bank president. McNamara, well educated and intellectually gifted, approached all the jobs given to him with a strong methodological approach, which he supported from lessons he had learned previously in life. Thus, Morris who often portrayed people's lives becomes a perfect match for McNamara who appears to want to share his lessons with the world in order to create an ever-growing source of enlightenment without causing further tribulations.
The documentary is organized in such manner that the objective of the lesson is evident, which is an essential tool for all teachers. All lessons begin with a black screen with white text that states the lesson, for example, "No. 1 Empathize with your enemy", "No. 5 Proportionality should be a guideline of war", and "No. 10 Never say never". From the objective screen, the film transitions to McNamara who begins to narrate directly to the audience about what he wants to have said, as he teaches the viewers from his mistakes. Through the eyes of McNamara, the audience gets to see how he reacts as he discloses choices he's made in his past and how he remembered people. This becomes very poignant as McNamara tells his story, especially when his eyes turn full of tears. Morris capture this moment through Interrotron, which is technology that captures the moment in first person.
The lessons shared dive into the history of World War II and the bombing of Japan, which was a result of research made by McNamara and others. The many bombs dropped on Japanese soil led to the death of several hundred thousand people along with fire and atomic bombs. McNamara also shares his lessons learned while advancing within the hierarchy of the Ford Motor Company. McNamara's time at the Ford Motor Company led him into getting the job as United States Secretary of Defense, which forced him to face the Cuban missile crisis. He then reflects on how near the United States and the world was to a nuclear war. The simple deduction by McNamara was that they avoided a nuclear conflict by the chance of luck. In the back of McNamara's head were the results of World War II and the Cuban Crisis, as he had to deal with the looming Vietnam conflict. The Kennedy assassination might have changed the course of the Vietnam conflict as McNamara recalls, as his eyes slowly fill with tears.
The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara offers a truly spectacular cinematic experience as it becomes a personal experience through the camera work of the film. McNamara's past, right or wrong, offers many important lessons, which the audience should ponder, as there is a real nuclear threat in the world. In conclusion, McNamara tries his personal best to make the world a better place, as he observes it with his own life long experiences.
25 President Bush, Heed His Advice
Although this documentary has nothing to do with the Bush administration, I find it very relevant to what is happening in the world today. It is basically a collection of interviews with Robert McNamara where he talks about the eleven lessons he learned from Vietnam and World War II. If only the Bush administration would heed his advice. Highly recommended.
26 All US Citizens Should see this movie
I am far to young to know anything about the life and term of Robert McNamera so I feel I am qualified to rate this film in an unbiased manner. Every citizan in the U.S. Should watch this movie as soon as possible. Perhaps you will notice the same arguements used to invade Vietnam as those used to invade Iraq. The old saying goes that those who ignore history are compelled to repeat it. We are repeating history and how many more of soldiers must die for a lie? How do you ask that last man to die for a lie? How do you explain to his mother or father that their son or daughter died for a lie?
27 The Fog Rolls Thick But Revelations Still Loom
This is a fascinating documentary made all the more exceptional by Errol Morris' unique filmmaking style, an uncanny ability to allow his subjects to reveal their inner truths without forcing them out. Constructed around two three-hour, sit-down interviews, this film focuses on the 85-year old Robert McNamara, former Secretary of Defense under JFK and LBJ and still very much a controversial historical figure for his purported role in escalating the Vietnam War. Filmed in 2001 but released last year, it avoids the feel of a purely "talking head" approach by including haunting archival footage and rare, unheard audio tapes, all accompanied by Phillip Glass' melancholy score, the combination of which makes for riveting, sometimes troubling viewing.
One particularly difficult episode has nothing to do with the Vietnam War. It's about his role on General Curtis LeMay's team during WWII, when the frighteningly hawkish LeMay decided to firebomb 67 Japanese cities, killing 100,000 Tokyo civilians in one night alone in 1945. Ghostly numbers appear with visuals of falling bombs, while McNamara breaks down as he describes the horror, fully realizing the extent of his war crimes had the Japanese been victorious. Even though the raids received less press than the atomic bomb drops, they took as many casualties. McNamara offers no apology, but does "empathize with the enemy", one of his eleven key lessons, even showing some personal remorse for his accountability. In fact, later under JFK, he recognized how Khrushchev wanted to avert war while saving face during the Cuban missile crisis, and consequently avoided a colder war than had existed. But McNamara failed to apply this lesson to Vietnam. When asked whether he feels any guilt about his role in Vietnam, he clams up and states that he's already said all he's going to say about it. Yet, he breaks down again when he recalls the impact of the Vietnam War on his wife and three children, all opposed to the war. He goes so far as to acknowledge that the traumas associated with his tenure as secretary may have ultimately killed his wife. It is a painful and poignant moment, but McNamara feels compelled, even when stricken with grief, to footnote that moment with the disclosure that they "were some of the best years of our life" and that "all members from my family benefited" from his days in Washington. The film gets rather gun-shy (pardon the pun) when explaining the relevance of lesson #9 ("Never apply military force unilaterally") to the current Iraqi conflict. Morris actually goes to great lengths to point out that this comment has nothing to do with Iraq or 9/11, and McNamara refuses to make his life lessons relevant to current U.S. military policy and speak against the assault on Iraq.
Even more than his actual words are the posture and oratory style by which McNamara expresses his viewpoints and recalls events. Didactic and always in control, McNamara asserts his intelligence lucidly, and despite his age, he seems to be in perfect command of his memory. Physically, he is unsurprisingly frailer nearly forty years after the Kennedy and Johnson administrations. There are moments of honest reflection that Morris captures unobtrusively, and McNamara remains amazingly alert, articulate and at times, charming. It does seem ironic that lesson #11 ("You can't change human nature') even suggests the possibility that the previous ten lessons are meaningless. McNamara himself says, "Never answer the question that is asked of you. Answer the question that you wished had been asked of you." This seems to sum up his participation in this documentary, as he answers what he wants and ignores the rest, the same approach he has taken in justifying Vietnam. A complicated man piercingly captured by a master filmmaker.
28 Exceptional History Lesson
Anyone interested in learning American History should definitely watch this documentary of the controversial figure Robert McNamara and his involvement with Vietnam War. But there is much more to McNamara and history than the Vietnam War. I wasn't aware of his involvement in WW II assisting in planning and evaluating bombing in Japan. I also wasn't aware of the fire bombs dropped in Japan prior to the drops of nuclear bombs. One of his lessons relates to the scale required to reach a war decision. He listed about 16 cities relating to American cities that were destroyed. For example, assume 40% of Los Angeles and 90% of Chattanooga were destroyed in Japanese cities, along with 14 others. This was with horrible fire bombs and is prior to nuclear drops. His point was that the cost of war was horrible and you could tell he had struggled with involvement with some of the decisions.
As it relates to the Vietnam War which was destined to be controversial, the most compelling part was listening to tapes of Johnson and McNamara talk. This allows the viewer to form his own opinion of what each were thinking. The bottom line is we work for the President and if he is leaning one way, it's likely the staff will lean that way also. And I don't mean this as a slam as it was compelling to listen to LBJ's thought process. Not saying he was right or wrong just that he had an opinion. Another interesting fact was that Kennedy was prepared to pull substantially out prior to the assassination of high Vietnamese officials. Also of interest in this period was his task in selecting the burial spot of Kennedy.
The closing is quite dramatic. With a close-up in a car of McNamara driving, he is asked why he didn't state his opinions after he resigned. And like a good soldier, he fell on his sword and refused to second guess or cause more controversy. What you see is an aging, intelligent man who gives people the opportunity to see through his as eyes as he was part of the power structure at the time of some costly and critical decisions. And by his tears, you can see he knows everything wasn't perfect but he did his job to the best of his ability. Frankly, I wish every cabinet member were required to give this type video exit interview and then be revisited 10 years later for an update. I think it would make for compelling history. If you are an American who lived through Vietnam or like American history, I encourage you to watch this and learn. Don't shoot the messenger. Pick the pieces that help you form an opinion and learn from them.
29 Pathetic attempt to atone for years of lying and war-crimes
This guy was a lying rubber-stamping mouthpiece for one of the most despicable presidents and one of the most evil wars the U.S. has ever participated in. Now in his old age he wants absolution by apologizing and saying he made honest mistakes. There are millions of asians and 50,000+ U.S. soldiers rotting in their graves largely because of the behavior of this moron. Drunk with power, he intentionally, repeatedly, and knowingly lied to the American people for years. He and Ollie North should both be tried for treason instead of travelling on the talk show circuit.
30 A Study of a Human Being
What is facinating about McNamara is not that he is a saint nor that he is a devil but that he is only a human. All humans make mistakes but because McNamara was in a position of such great power the repercusstions of the mistakes led to the deaths of tens of thousands of inoccent lives.
This is perhaps the reason for the pervaiding aura of sadness McNamara conveys in this film. It also accounts for his inibility to connect events in his life to those around him. He can understand the problem with fire bombing civilian targets in Japan but cannot fathom his own part in it.
This is a facinating look into what happens when good men do bad things.
31 Excellent documentary
At 85, Robert McNamara has a lot to tell. He served three years in the U.S. army during World War II, seven years as U.S. Secretary of Defense (invited by Kennedy), thirteen years as President of the World Bank, and briefly as President of Ford Motor. Basically, this man has been through a lot and it is incredible that he is willing and able to discuss openly what happened back then. Some label him as an "arrogant dictator" that cares more about facts and figures than human life. Others praise him as the man whose leadership allowed the United States to stand tall through difficult times. Either way, his life had a tremendous impact on the security and welfare of the world.
The film presents "11 lessons" to learn from McNamara's life. These are no ordinary lessons though; they are of utmost importance. This is because these lessons were derived from "war mistakes." For example, the bombing of a city could actually be considered a mistake. These lessons have to be taken seriously as a matter of life and death. McNamara stresses that "errors of judgment" in the past were acceptable in the amount of 3 or 4 mistakes, but with the advent of nuclear weapons there can be NO mistakes. This is because entire nations are now at risk of annihilation. McNamara is speaking from his heart when he says we have to "try to learn" these lessons and pass them on to future generations.
The U.S. government "looked down the gun barrel into nuclear war." "Ninety million Americans targeted by Cuban warheads." "It was luck that prevented nuclear war." And best of all, "that danger still exists today." This is pretty serious stuff coming from former Secretary of Defense. I was captivated at how McNamara's tone of voice is still optimistic about life, after so many people being killed under his watch. I was equally captivated at his ability to find positive aspects of war. It's all a little bit scary.
This film is all about human mindsets. Human mindset is what creates wars and is the only way to effectively stop war before total destruction ensues. It is incredible to have the opportunity to explore McNamara's thinking so closely. He was confronted with the core dilemma of war. For example, if you spare 1,000 Japanese lives today, the result would be 10,000 American soldiers killed unnecessarily next month. The reason for war is defense; kill or be killed. Unfortunately, the reason is sometimes based on misguided assumption or lies such as the "attack on the USS Maddox." The decision making process between the United States President and other high ranking officials during times of war is often marked by stress. The recorded conversation between LBJ and McNamara is incredibly scary. Simply put, LBJ, the President of the United States, has no deep respect for life and speaks with shocking arrogance. Throughout McNamara's career, he forced himself to answer many difficult humanitarian questions with "yes." His mindset was often: the strategic answer is "yes", the internal judgment is "no", therefore the final answer is "yes." This is unfortunate...
During this film, I could not help but question McNamara's inner motivation. It really pulled at my emotions when McNamara described his grade school teacher. He had a "superb" teacher who ordered the seats in rank according to grades. Maybe this is where he first encountered the concept of ambition. It almost brought tears to my eyes watching his facial expressions as he described how he competed against the other students. Does he really take to heart Jefferson's words "that all men are created equal?" McNamara mentions his annual salary at least two times and that his family benefited from his status. Money is important, but I do not think it should have any motivating force when your career deals with the juggling of human lives. McNamara depersonalized war decisions. There is no way he could have carried out his duty otherwise. McNamara became very emotional when describing the loss of a single American wingman after the bombing of an entire Japanese city! He could hardly speak without bawling when describing Kennedy's assassination, but gracefully pulls out statistics like 100,000 Japanese (many civilian) die in the fire bombing of Tokyo. If the fire bombing was more than a mere mental concept, or if his own brother was one of those Japanese citizens, he would have broken down emotionally when telling about them. His personal reality is real, war is just a bunch of concepts that won't go away.
Towards the end of the film, it is obvious that McNamara is still haunted by unspoken grievances (personal and political). I can see some recognition of his own regret and I cannot help but feel sorry for all he has been through. He acted in the best of his knowledge and ability, but I think he still feels that was not enough. All he can do now is accept it because it could not be otherwise, move on to greater things, and "try to learn."
32 Reliving the past
HAving grown up wathching Kennedy and Johnson and McNamara on our black and white tv, it was hauting to listen to McNamara talk about it. He raises some issues that neither Republicans nor Democrats can answer...
I do need to very a few statements from the movie. For example, is it really true thet McNamara got Ford to introduce seat belts and padded dashboards without governement legislation. If so, score one for capitalism!
Also, I was taught that Kennedy was getting ready to send large numbers of troops into Viet Nam before he was assassinated. McNamara contradicted that.
33 A Wonderful Attempt to Fool Americans
McNamara continues to lie and should save his soulless tears for Judgment Day. This interview should be watched by everyone, but only to better our understanding of how an evil mind works. Any student in 101 history would be able to catch his disgusting distortions of the facts. He'd like us to believe he is this poor misunderstood manipulated victim of history and politics. This man is no wise loving grandpa, he's a war criminal! I highly recommend this film.
34 Robert McNamara's "troubled and unrested conscience".!
Robert McNamara makes an attempt, somewhat exhaustive, on why the United States went to war in Vietnam. Mr. McNamara fails to see one thing or fails to recognize a deeper principle: the cost of wars on the innocent is not going to allow him to rest comfortably. He is trying to validate, to justify, to legally argue all the "rights" for intervention in Vietnam.
There is a segment in which a former Vietnamese military officer tells Mr. McNamara that he is not sure where Mr. McNamara learned his history. He goes on to say that Vietnam was a nationalist war: first, against the French imperialist, second, against the U.S. intervention. Mr. McNamara, then, tries to acknowledge what this former military officer was saying, but, it is also evident, underneath layers of masks that he wears, that his conscience knows that the war was wrong.
Ho Chin Minh wrote President Truman two letters in attempts to avoid any conflict with the U.S. He pleaded for other diplomatic avenues to avoid war, and all pleads were ignored.
This historical review surprises me because I am totally shocked that Mr. McNamara would not or did not bother to review other presidential involvement before promoting and supporting military intervention in Vietnam.
Mr. McNamara......the conscience does not lie!
35 Will We Ever Learn?
This documentary presents a chilling account of the horrors of war (WWII and Vietnam) and a superb insight into the lessons learned from these wars. It talks about the mindset of war and aggression and how that war crimes are just part of that mindset. Killing hordes of enemy civilians doesn't seem to be a bad idea in the grander picture of things. It seems like we never learn from our mistakes. With nukes scattered across the globe, our learning-from-mistakes curve has been reduced to a single dot; make a mistake and you won't live to learn from it.
36 Pathetic advice from a hollow man
Robert McNamara is soft-spoken, sensitive, intelligent -- not an evil man, at least in conventional terms. He doesn't speak harshly, scowl or drip fire from his eyes. It is his central place in pursuing ravaging wars that makes him a villian in this eyes of man, and a patriot in the eyes of some. Hearing "Mac" describe himself is what makes this film so interesting.
The worst you could probably say about McNamara is that there is a serious disconnect between his calculated policies and the suffering, terror and death that resulted from them. McNamara is aware, at least intellectually, that his decisions caused suffering; that awareness is just another data point in his life, and doesn't seem to stop him or bother him all that much. At some level, every war counselor must dissociate himself from human suffering, otherwise military operations would be impossible to carry out. Ulysses S. Grant was not called "The Butcher" because he was unwilling to send wave after wave of Union troops into the maws of death at Vicksburg. At some point, however, you hope that those who take on this awesome burden will be humbled and transformed. McNamara, for all the death and destruction attributed to him -- from Hiroshima to Vietnam -- seems almost completely unaffected by the enormity of his historical role.
McNamara's recall is extraordinary, as is his ability to carefully categorize and logically lay out his experiences. But he is altogether a hollow (if not soulless) man, seemingly deaf to pain. Though he sees how others could regard him as a war criminal (based on his work against Japan during WWII), the charge (and its possible truth) doesn't affect him emotionally. It just seems to be another quantitative fact of life, like the weather or the result of a vote. He often seems wistful, but never sad or horrified.
"The Fog of War" is a lesson about the kind of person used by government to prosecute wars. He doesn't necessarily have to be a warmonger or have deep-seated psychological scars. He can simply be the kind of human calculator with no more visceral attachment to feeding humans into the machinery of death than of feeding cars down an assembly line. Significantly, McNamara did both jobs. One can only wish that he stuck with the machines and left war to those with a deeper capacity for emotion.
37 Engaging Documentary
The film consist solely of interviews with one Robert Strange McNamara (yes that's a real middle name), who as Secretary of Defense was involved in the Cuban Missile Crisis and the Vietnam War, not to mention the firebombing of Japan while serving in WWII. His story is roughly divided into 11 lessons, with the majority of them devoted to the Vietnam War. This is really a fascinating look back on our own history, where events become frighteningly demystified over the course of the film. Highlights include discussions on how close we came to full out nuclear war over Cuba, and how he would have been tried as a war criminal had U.S. lost WWII for firebombing Japan, where more than half of the civilian populations in dozens of Japanese cities were killed. Morris smartly didn't allow the film to degenerate into a talking head picture by using various archival footage and computer graphics, among other things, to counterpoint McNamara's statements visually. Morris employed that method with a high degree of effectiveness, and along with McNamara's engaging personality and surprising candor made sure we were never bored. Perhaps the most chilling aspect of the film is the discussion of the Vietnam War, which errily parallels our current war with Iraq in too many areas. You would think the mistakes made and the lessons learned from Vietnam would be applied today, but all we are doing is recycling the same mistakes and uncovering new ones. This should be a required viewing of any presidential administration and we can only hope the situation in Iraq doesn't deteriorate as badly as it did in Vietnam.
38 America never learns
This film illustrates how so-called rational people can make such incredibly irrational and dangerous decisions, by examining the thought processes of America's leaders responsible for the Vietnam War.
It is amazing to me how much of this film is relevant to our current actions in Iraq. One would think that America would have learned some valuable lessons in Vietnam; yet here we are 30 years later caught in another overseas quagmire in a third world country thousands of miles away.
I would encourage anyone to see Fog of War, especially those too young to have experienced the Vietnam War era.
39 Excellent
Robert Mcnamara was an academic who worked in the war with bomber command. He was responsible for quantitative analysis of the effect of the strategic air war. His first study found that 20% of American bomber runs over Germany were aborted largely as a result of cowardice. Mcnamara concedes that cowardice is perhaps a strong word but the reality is that US bomber groups were taking heavy casualties over Germany with 4% of planes being shot down each mission. The stark reality of those figures is that 10 missions would see 40% of the crews not return and 20 see 80% not return. As the normal tour of duty was 25 missions one could understand the response of bomber crews. One being given Mcnamara's figures Air Force General Curtis Lee May made the decision to fly personally in the lead aircraft of each mission and court marshal any crew who turned back.
Later in the Japanese theatre Mcnamara did the analysis that showed high level bombing was ineffective and as a result the United States adopted a policy of targeting cities by aircraft flying at a low level dropping fire bombs. The sixty largest Japanese cities were targeted. (The exceptions being Hiroshima and Nagasaki). The cities targeted by fire bombing suffered immense casualties with 40%-50% of those cities destroyed with civilian deaths estimated from anywhere between 400,000 to millions. Mcnamara concedes that if the US had lost the war he would have been judged a war criminal.
Following the war Mcnamara worked for Ford and using the same quantitative approach that he had to killing tried to sell cars. He was able to turn around the fortune of the Ford Motor company by the development of the Falcon and by making huge breakthroughs in driving safety. He then gave up his enormous salary to work as the Secretary of Defence in the Kennedy and Johnson administration.
The main power of the documentary probably comes from the discussion about the Cuban Missile crisis. At the time Mcnamara had not realised how close to nuclear war the world came. On discovering the fact that the Soviets had placed missiles on Cuba the Joint Chiefs of staff suggested an air attack and invasion. This was premised on the fact that they believed there were no nuclear war heads on the island and if they acted promptly they could get rid of the missiles before any war heads arrived. What the Joints Chiefs did not know was that the Soviets had already shipped 150 war heads to the island and that Castro has urged the Soviets to use them if Cuba was attacked. The world avoided by a whisker the destruction of the southern third of the United States and presumably most of the Soviet Union.
Mcnamara makes the point that war is a clumsy business. The people running it generally don't really know how to do it until they have done it for a while as shown by his examples from the Second World War. Nuclear was is just to destructive to be placed in the hands of the most rational of men because they can make the sorts of mistakes that can lead to unimaginable destruction.
The documentary covers the Vietnam War as well and the style of contrasting the interview of the 85 year old Mcnamara with contemporary footage and voice recordings of him speaking to Johnstone are fascinating. After watching this you are reminded how much the work of Michael Moore is that of an artful propagandist and entertainer rather than that of a deep thinker.
40 ....Is Lifted By Aged Wisdom
For anyone concerned about war and the repercussions of a single mis-guided bomb this documentary will shed some light on often ignored ideas about the subject of war.
This film contains mostly historical images and memories of the Cold War Era, World War II and Vietnam as seen through the perspective of Former Defense Secretary Robert McNamara. Despite looking at war through hindsight the results remain the same, civilians die in despair, soldiers are placed in harms way and educated desk jockeys with a famous name direct it all behind the cover of powerful governments. I found McNamara to be both humble and amazingly sensitive to the catastrophe of what he subjected our American soldiers to during the Vietnam War. Even though McNamara was notorious for being arrogant, uncommunicative and boldly defiant when faced with protecting his presidents (Kennedy & Johnson), with age I think you will find he has mellowed and looked at his wake honestly and with some regrets. I found him to be similar to our current Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, who has apparently not learned any of the lessons McNamara is teaching these days. I wonder if Rumsfeld will be so forthcoming in another 30 years to admit his weaknesses and errors along with his administrations.
McNamara claims that war cannot end without ruining communities and propagating death and destruction in its wake. He is honest in his description of the loss that other countries have suffered at our often expedient retaliations, for instant 100,000 people were incinerated in Tokyo alone PRIOR to dropping nuclear weapons during WWII and he feels that this occurred partly because of his analysis of what the weapons our government was developing could do. McNamara clearly states he felt he acted as a war criminal but was never tried. He also fully admits responsibility for the deaths of thousands of civilians. He questions the survivability of the human race when over 2500 nuclear weapons exist within reach of a single world leader who chooses to make a very bad decision on any given day. He feels that war morality is purely based upon winning and that leaders choose war because they believe what the see and not what is truth. Funny how that statement applies today! Interestingly enough even in Vietnam our generals were asking for more troops while the Washington desk jockeys reduced the call-up by half and this fact continues to occur today. Many aspects of this film will clearly resonate within the Iraq war. So how much evil will eventually equal good?
Robert McNamara provides 10 lessons about war that need to be heeded by all future generations and leaders:
1. The human race will not eliminate war but can reduce brutality by seeking "just" wars.
2. Human fallibility and nuclear weapons will lead to destruction.
3. America is not omniscient and should not proceed unilaterally except in our own defense.
4. Moral principles are ambiguous but US Foreign policy should seek to avoid the carnage of 160 million dead in the 20th century alone.
5. We have failed as a nation to advance fundamental necessities of nutrition, literacy, health and employment both at home and abroad.
6. Corporate executives have a responsibility to their employees, their customers and to society as a whole.
7. Kennedy states: "The primary responsibility of a president is to keep the nation out of war if at all possible."
8. Individuals should be held responsible for crimes against humanity and a system of jurisprudence based on the International Court should be supported.
9. Terrorism will not be dealt with effectively without empathy.
10. The U.S. is contributing to the breakdown of the Non-Proliferation Regime and placing society at risk of terrorists obtaining weapons of mass destruction.
It seems the fog has indeed been lifted but now it takes listening to. Afterall "out of the mouth of babes" may come something interesting but true wisdom always comes from the elders, those folks that have lived through exactly what we never want to live through again but are on the verge of doing. The most profound revelation I learned from this film was a fact that McNamara struggled over, he stated that the mere mention of withdrawing troops from Vietnam by Kennedy resulted in the military coup that killed Diem of South Vietnam and began the war in Vietnam. Aren't we currently doing the same in South Korea and will America only be left to blame once again? McNamara's learned wisdom is important to contemplate but more significant is caring how we are represented by our government to the rest of the world and realizing that all of the blood shed in our name can never be washed clean. It will always leave the threat of fog if we place our future in the wrong hands.
41 If you've any interest in 20th century American history...
I'll save the summary for everyone else who's already done it. This is a documentary that could have kept going, and I wouldn't have cared. I felt like crying a few times. I felt anger.
And rarest of all, I felt interest for a time period that is neither my primary field, nor country. I'm a pre-19th century European historian, not 20th century American. That's a first.
I'm also not a war fan, don't like war movies, am not good with dates and battles and strategies... but this documentary pulled me in.
Don't expect the reading of a standard history book, nor a glowing report of our leaders through the World Wars and Vietnam, because you won't get one.
Don't expect to see footage of protestors with their flower power or sappy, lingering tributes to fallen soldiers and leaders (such as JFK).
Do expect to see eleven lessons flashed up on the screen throughout the documentary, and be prepared to be startled over one of them, at least.
Do expect to see a former Secretary of State, in a thoroughly lucid and entertaining state at age 85, talking about events some of us grew up with, or had parents who wouldn't talk about because they were desperately trying to forget.
As much as I enjoy Michael Moore, skip him over and get this first. It may not be about our current events, but these events created the nation we live in today. That's vital.
42 A Documentary Worth Seeing
In this era of "reality" TV and pop documentaries it's refreshing to see a no spin political documentary that basks in it's truth rather than manipululates it. Robert McNamara becomes a rarity in Washington by candidly reflecting on his mistakes and triumphs as Secretary of Defense under both Kennedy and Johnson. He does this because he feels that he has something to teach us, our administration , as well as future administrations about war and politics. It's an incredibly important documentary and should be required viewing for anybody taking office.
This emotion impact of this film is surprising. Credit goes to both McNamara and Errol Morris who takes such a complex subject and simplifying it both visually and emotionally; by the end of the film you'll want to give McNamara another shot at redemption.
43 The Clarity of War
Errol Morris interviews Robert S. McNamera, former US Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) under JFK and LBJ, and once CEO of the Ford Motor Company. McNamera later became president of the World Bank Group of Institutions from 1968-1981.
For those seeking answers to why the US went to Vietnam, you may be disappointed. McNamera purposely avoids this question as much as possible, but does admit that he and his fellow administrators made some crucial mistakes in judging the conflict in the first place. As for the Cuban missile crisis, McNamera recounts that, despite the best intentions of the US and the Russians to avoid the conflict, we almost didn't prevail (this section is a great supplement for those who liked the film, "Thirteen Days").
This film is not so much about McNamera's role in the Vietnam war for which he is most famous, but more about one man's view of war in general over the last century. McNamera gives a very honest and straight-forward response to the strengths and shortcomings of the JFK and LBJ administrations, and more importantly of himself. While this is not a documentary on the history of war, (WWII, the Cuban missile crisis, or the Vietnam war in particular), McNamera honestly reflects on the strengths and shortcomings of US foreign policies over the last century.
I was pleased to see that McNamera wasn't completely defensive concerning his role in the White House. He readily admits when he was wrong, which is refreshing to hear from any statesman. Even at age 85, McNamera gives a surprisingly candid response despite the fact that he is arguably one of the biggest scapegoats in history. He is not overly crotchety or defensive as one might expect. In fact, he has had enough distance and clarity to form some very honest opinions of himself and US foreign policy in general.
By the end of the film, McNamera brings up the question, "how much evil must we do in order to do good." He says this in response to the grudgingly admitted fire bombing tactics of WWII he personally developed to use against the Japanese. He argues that in WWII, the only way to end the war was to kill your enemy before he kills you. This is a gruesome statement, and one that he obviously makes with a bitter tongue. I don't believe he enjoyed performing any of his wartime tasks, but he believes they were the only measures available to him.
This is a compelling topic because at the highest levels of state, there may be times, when going to war may be unavoidable (ex. WWII), and that you unfortunately have to kill in order to preserve yourself. The problem, however, is always finding the right wars to engage in and the ones to avoid. And if you find yourself in a "just" war, is there any humane way to conduct it? Is there a civil way to conduct war? My assessments of McNamera's response to this subject is, no; war is hell. There is no such thing as a clean war. And, he states, war will not be eradicated in the future due to humankind's tendency for conflict.
McNamera says that the conventional wisdom is to learn from the mistakes of history, however, there is no learning curve in a nuclear war as he states. You cannot make mistakes. One mistake could mean the end. One nuclear missile launched is equivalent to all missiles being launched, and thus the end of civilization as we know it.
McNamera gives a list of eleven lessons of war in order to avoid war in the future. They are not mind-blowing or extra-insightful, but they do remind us of what McNamera is trying to tell us in this film: war is ugly, irrational, and usually avoidable only under the most luckiest of circumstances.
Overall, the film is worth seeing if only for the insight into the workings of the White House at the time. By the end of the film I found it hard-pressed to say if the US would have done better without him. You may have a hard time judging McNamera as well. He speaks like a war monger who hates his job and never wanted it; like a man who was faced with the ultimate decision, and completed the tasks presented to him as best he could, even if those tasks were some of the most grueling in history.
44 McNamara comes clean in `The Fog of War'
Director Errol Morris' latest triumph, "The Fog of War," is a retrospective glance at some of America's toughest times, including World War II, the Cold War and the Vietnam War. These haunting moments are revisited through the view of Robert McNamara, secretary of defense under John F. Kennedy and Lyndon B. Johnson.
McNamara stares right into the eyes of the viewer as he recounts his past, from his time as an Army Air Force lieutenant colonel to his stint as Ford Motor Company president to his work as defense secretary. We see McNamara as a faultless chap at the University of California at Berkeley in 1937. We discover McNamara's part in the development of seat belts, an invention that would reduce the incalculable number of injuries caused by automobile collisions.
We also learn of a botched firebombing over Japan that resulted in about 100,000 civilian casualties, a raid for which McNamara was partly responsible. Making this scene even more mortifying is McNamara's unflinching expression as he relays the event with hardly a grain of remorse. McNamara speaks of the avoidance of total nuclear war as sheer luck.
"Take it from me, we were literally this close to mutually allied destruction," McNamara barks, as he narrows the gap between his thumb and index finger to nearly a pinch.
During a recorded telephone conversation in 1965 with President Johnson, we hear McNamara's voice wither into nonexistence in protest to the commander-in-chief's vow to escalate the conflict in Vietnam.
In the film, McNamara outlines 11 lessons he has learned during his turbulent life. Below are three that come to mind:
Empathize with your enemy: McNamara said that had the United States attempted to empathize with North Vietnam, the conflict may have subsided with little loss of life. McNamara said that while the United States' purpose in southeast Asia was to prevent the further spread of communism, North Vietnam saw the conflict as a civil war between two radically different governing factions.
Seeing and believing can both be wrong: McNamara places emphasis on the incident at the Gulf of Tonkin. Was there or wasn't there a second attack? Was President Johnson's full-fledged bombing strike premature?
Proportionality should be a guideline in war: It's shocking how many Japanese civilians were killed or wounded during World War II before the United States dropped the atomic bombs.
Overall, the viewer gains a humanistic understanding of McNamara through this film. But even at 85, McNamara still won't elaborate on the more scintillating pieces of information, such as whether he thinks LBJ was mistaken in his efforts to accelerate the "crusade" in Vietnam.
45 The Fog of War - appropriate title for something McNamara
Mr. McNamara, inarguably the worst secratary of defense in the history of the US, demonstrates perfectly that learning is not equal to wisdom.
His many disasters, miscalculations and blunders helped make the Vietnam conflict into the mess that people & historians recollect today.
46 Choking on Bogus Remorse
If you can endure hearing one of the chief architects of American imperialist foreign policy, during it's most openly violent and repressive heyday (well, until now that is), drone on and on about his life's regrets, then this is definitely the documentary for you. Leftist propaganda??!! Don't make me laugh. This has all the heartfelt sincerity of listening to some ex-minister of the Third Reich, like Albert Speer, weeping over what horrible atrocities the Nazis carried out during the war, how it makes them lose sleep, etc. A fitting comparison, actually, because if McNamara had been held up against those laws established at Nuremburg, he would have been executed. Hell, at least Speer went to jail for a while. I like Morris' work but found this almost unbearable. McNamara even repeats some of the bogus armament figures that have since been debunked by declassified records. Thanks, but I'll save my sympathy for those hundreds of thousands murdered by executive policies he either implemented or whole-heartedly supported.
47 chilling and relevant documentary
Errol Morris has a long career of making interesting documentaries, and with The Fog of War we become privy to the thoughts of Robert McNamara, JFK's Secretary of Defense and one of the primary architects of the Vietnam War.
Illustrating his "ten lessons" are McNamara's observations on WW2, the Cuban Missile Crisis and the Vietnam War. Morris inserts thought-provoking images and Philip Glass's score is, as always, haunting and evocative.
I know a fair bit about our country's wars, but still found new revelations here, as well as chilling parallels to our own generation's Iraq War -- the beginnings based on faulty information and assumptions, the escalation, etc.
DVD extras include additional scenes, McNamara's ten lessons and LBJ's infamous countdown ad. The film can be heard in English with optional subtitles in Japanese, French, Spanish or Portuguese.
48 McNamara unplugged
This is a very compelling, if not all together satisfying interview with Robert McNamara. Although, given the consequences of the Vietnam War, I suppose this is as forthcoming as we can expect McNamara to be.
Errol Morris instersperses the interview with videos and stills from McNamara's life, whose first memory is of a celebration after the victory in WWI, the war to end all wars. To listen to McNamara, he never wanted to be the Secretary of Defense, but when pressed by JFK, accepted the role. He said he never regretted it, although judging by the lessons he learned during those 7 years in office, one gets the sense that he has thought about it every day since.
McNamara has a razor sharp intellect that doesn't appear to have diminished with age. He is so articulate on his positions, noting, repeatedly, the climate that was created at the time by the Cold War, and that almost any military action was considered justifiable during those dangerous times. Through it all, McNamara tried to remain the voice of reason, but as he notes in the interview, reason doesn't always prevail. One has to learn how to empathize with the enemy, which he felt Kennedy did with Krushchev in the Cuban Missile Crisis, but that none of them in the Johnson administration was able to get into the mind of the Vietnamese.
These lessons could well apply today, as we find ourselves engaged in a "war on terror" on two fronts. McNamara, at the time of the crisis, bears more than a passing resemblance to Rumsfeld, and one senses the anguish that comes with the decisions that have been made, at least in McNamara. We may think we are fighting for Democracy, but getting that message through to the belligerants in a country is another matter, and here, it seems, is where we lost the war.
49 Eleven lessons
Robert McNamara, one of the brightest and one of the best Camelot bred cold warriors, reminisces.
FOG OF WAR is pretty much a monologue conducted by former Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara, with a few questions shouted by an off-screen interviewer. The film is divided into eleven "lessons," introduced by a short, epigrammatic title card: Empathize with your enemy, Get the Data, etc. Filmmaker Errol Morris won an Academy award and it's easy to see why. Few extended talking head programs are this riveting. It helps, I suppose, that this central figure in the early history of the Vietnam War was still so sharp and lucid, although still a tad reticent to engage in an in-depth discussion of Vietnam. Smart use of archival footage and still photographs, and a pulsing undertone score by Philip Glass, make this a treat for anyone interested in Cold War politics circa 1965.
50 Interesting to hear from one that "was there"
It's not every day that you get a documentary shoot on one of the top players.
That is the good thing on this movie; it's straight from the "horses mouth"
But the downside is that failed to engage me.
I found it a bit boring.
Personally I would have preferred if the interviewer had been more active and engaged in conversion instead of making it a McNamara monologue.
51 Propaganda or a Documentary?
I've read many reviews saying that this piece of "left-wing propaganda" is inaccurate and "dubbed." If this is so, why hasn't Robert McNamara said anything about his words being changed? Also, books written by McNamara "WIlson's Ghost" and "In Retrospect" parallel what's said in the film. Is this also "dubbed"? Oh yeah, it's his words, on paper, that doesn't make sense. And how about those audio clips of Johnson and McNamara? Fake? Quit it.
Now, to the film. This documentary shows clips of McNamara speaking on rules government should go through before engaging in war, which is to be used only under extreme circumstances. There are also extra snippets of interviews in the special features. This is a very revealing film, and shows interesting contrast between McNamara then, and how he sees things now. This isn't "left-wing propaganda", save that for Farenheight 9/11 if you would be so conservative, this is McNamara talking about war, and what he thinks of it. Don't listen to biased critism, it's rediculous and slanted.
52 The Lion in Winter
In "The Fog of War," what we have is the fascinating, disturbing, perplexing, riveting, and sometimes maddening confession/explanation/"lessons-learned" exercise of a formerly powerful "lion," now in the late winter of his life and looking for...well, something. The "lion" here is Vietnam War era Secretary of Defense Robert Strange McNamara, one of the "best and the brightest" of his era, and one of the most controversial - both admired and reviled -- figures in American history. Like the other Kennedy/Johnson "best and brightest" intellectuals, McNamara attended the finest schools - Berkeley and Harvard - and rose to positions of great power, both in World War II as a top advisor to Colonel (later Genera) Curtis LeMay, as President of Ford Motor Company, and finally as Secretary of Defense under John F. Kennedy and Lyndon Johnson.
A student of philosophy, economics, and business administration, McNamara brought a fascinating, even unique, mix of skills to his job as Secretary of Defense during the 1960s. Ultimately, however, despite McNamara's great intellectual abilities and fine educational background, in the end it can only be said that he was a miserable failure, in both the practical and moral senses. For starters, McNamara must accept a significant part of the blame for the hubris, mistakes, misjudgments, and moral failings that characterized the entire Vietnam era. More fundamentally, McNamara's entire approach, which was essentially to use data, statistics, and logical analysis techniques to bring hard rationality and cold efficiency to the inherently irrational, inefficient, unreasonable, chaotic, and bloody "fog" of war, led not to success but instead to disaster - in economic, national, and human terms. As McNamara himself now concludes, in one of his 11 "lessons" that form the organizational structure of this movie, "rationality will not save us."
In "The Fog of War," we watch and listen as McNamara attempts - forcefully, articulately, emotionally, and often awkwardly -- to explain his life as an individual human being and also as part of the broader picture; to admit that he made errors while at the same time shifting the blame for his (many) failings to others (Curtis LeMay, President Johnson) and failing to take full personal responsibility for his actions; to convey the lessons he feels he has learned from his life while simultaneously failing to follow those lessons to their logical conclusions or to integrate them in a coherent, non-self-contradictory manner; to hint at his own psychological/emotional struggles as a public and private figure while again stopping short of truly revealing much of his inner life (i.e., he mentions that his years as Secretary of Defense caused great hardship - tremendous stress, ulcers - for his family, yet he refuses to say more than that and still holds that those were great years of his life); and to wrestle - a bit belatedly and weakly, one might add -- with philosophical questions of right and wrong, such as "in order to do good, you may have to engage in evil."
As McNamara speaks, we also watch and listen to the historical images and audio recordings of World War II, the Cuban Missile Crisis, and Vietnam. As McNamara stares at us directly (yet blankly, evasively, and disconcertingly - what is he thinking and feeling?), we also hear and feel the ominous, foreboding, anxious, vaguely disturbing Philip Glass score pulsing along in the background. The combination of all these elements results in a powerful documentary film that fully deserved its Academy Award.
Just three more (brief) points about "The Fog of War:" 1) this movie should be required viewing for all of our top political and military leaders; 2) those leaders include, first and foremost, the current Secretary of Defense, Don Rumsfeld, who bears an unnerving resemblance to Robert McNamara in many ways; and 3) if it does nothing else, this movie powerfully argues for not placing too much faith in our leaders, because as McNamara's Cuban Missile Crisis example points out so well, they often are just as confused, caught up in their own misconceptions, stuck in their own worldview, and dependent upon blind luck as the rest of us.
53 Shock and Awe from the 60's
You have to see this, you also have to read some McNamara reference material, namely his autobiography. Then ask yourselves one question.
Given that there are 50,000+ plus names up on the "Black Wall" and armed with all the new information you have acquired on McNamara from McNamara... plus all the Post Viet Nam related deaths, suicides, emotional struggles etc...
Why isn't McNamara in prison?
A very insightful interview, I recommend reading the McNamara autobiography as a precursor to viewing this. A statistician such as McNamara was able to calculate his way through the mire of Viet Nam; strongarming policy,and making tactical decisions he had absolutely no business making; furthermore he justified his actions/decisions. Was his justification actually self-denial amid the abysmal failure of Viet Nam and the consequencial negative impact on hundreds of thousands of the effected generation!? Amazing!
I have to ask the question that: Given that there are 50,000+ plus names up on the "Black Wall" in addition to all the revealing information on McNamara from McNamara, add up all the Post Viet Nam related deaths, suicides, emotional and substance struggles and abuse.
Why isn't McNamara in prison?
Documentaries (and books) such as this put a whole new slant on the Kennedy and Johnson administrations, they were as corrupt as Nixon, and as slippery as Clinton. I really wish all who laud and praise the Kennedy administration would realize what a negative influence that administration had on so many of the generation it put to war.
After Nixon negotiated a "Peace with honor" tradeoff with Hanoi and after the debacle was finally over, was JFK's oft-quoted "ask what you can do for you country" in reality a verbal death knell? What were people in power thinking as thousands of America's youth joined Kennedy on the hillsides of Arlington cemetery?
Why isn't McNamara in prison?
54 Required viewing for those supporting the War in Iraq . . .
Watch this and learn . . . this is a chilling documentary of what goes on in the "war room" of U.S. government. If the Vietnam vets had known at the time this is what the "great minds" in their government were discussing, they'd have left, and are probably now, turning in their graves.
55 One of the Best Documentaries Ever
Errol Morris is the best documentary film maker ever and The Fog of War is his crowning achievement. The film explores the complexity of war and how it evolves. There is no political bias or agenda here...just plain truth and facts. Great work and a must see.
This film won Best Documentary at the 2003 Academy Awards and many other Festival Awards. It would be a shame if you missed out on this wonderful work of art.
56 Simple and stirring
It is basically a guy in his eighties, a talking head,
speaking to a camera, with some background questions
by the film maker, with some graphics and words
thrown in. THAT'S ALL FOLKS!
Also, it is one of the best documentary movies
ever made, and a testament to the power of narrative!
57 McNamara up close
It is the tragedy of American politics--particularly in its foreign policies--that obtuseness and intractability are admired and confused with stability and willpower, while the ability to take a measure of a situation, speak of it as it is and act prudently is viewed with suspicion and derision. It is in this way our presidents paint themselves and the country into corners, and usually leave future generations to sort out the mess.
We see this in watching FOG OF WAR, a documentary covering not just the Vietnam era, but Robert McNamara's life and career. As an 85 year old man, McNamara no longer has to please anyone, and he seems determined to leave not just the historical consequences of his career to us, but a legacy of introspection to future generations. Anyone arguing that he is not just apologizing, which is rather simplistic, but rationalizing his career are partially right, but his searing critiques of himself and US policies cannot be ignored. In many ways, it is the questions that he himself raises, and leaves open, that are the most fascinating insight into his moral development in old age.
The segments on his WWII service are well worth watching just for themselves, for this reason. McNamara was at the forefront of applying quantitative methodology, statistical analysis, to the prosecution of war. This is something that the US pioneered and remains to this day its most effective practitioner. The same techniques of analysis that New York uses to combat crime were applied to find the most efficient ways to wage total war. That the answer was, in the end, to slaughter as many enemy civilians as possible was merely a logical conclusion of the methodology, the moral aspect didn't factor into this. The documentary makers' graphics of bombers dropping numbers and symbols on cities perfectly captures this.
It's been some time since I watched this, so I won't go into detail. However, I think everyone should see this; every high school civics class should watch it; and every college campus should present it. The complexity of political morality comes through. You could also tell that the makers challenged McNamara; in the rare instances you hear their questions to him, it is usually in an incredulous tone. I think that challenge was something McNamara was determined to meet in as honest a way as he could, and it enhances the power of his words.
Parts of it are organized into chapters, "McNamara's lessons of war." It is an interesting and I think fruitful approach. After Vietnam, American society approached the war mainly at the visceral level, through movies and painful subjective accounts, and reflection on the social divisions of the era. Recently, it seems that Vietnam is being approached on a more sophisticated level, in terms of the questions raised and the answers given or discovered. FOG OF WAR contributes to that.
McNamara, we are reminded, also served for some time as president of the World Bank. Knee-jerk anti-globalists, while they have a lot of reasonable objections to the destructiveness of the market religion, like to focus on a few institutions as their bogeymen. The incompetence and intellectual bankruptcy of the IMF needs no mentioning, however I suggest the rabble-rousers consider carefully McNamara's account of the World Bank.
The DVD extras are interesting in their own right, and a few serve to amplify the documentary. I suggest the DVD THE TRIALS OF HENRY KISSINGER as a fitting companion to this. Fully deserves five stars.
58 Great but with a question mark
Erroll Morris--you can't argue with his amazing mind, his interviewing technique or his choice of subjects. He has been one of the most creative, ground-breaking doc directors in Amerca ever. I have nothing but praise and kudos for his work.
One big question however. In this film he adopts the style of Godfrey Reggio's ...Qatsi films. The style is so unique and specific to Reggio's films that I have no idea why Morris felt the need to copy it when he has long established his own style. A big puzzle to this ardent fan.
59 Out of context and some dubbing detected ! Don't be fooled.
Throughout this entire production of left wing propaganda, Robert was taken out of context and you can tell from the way they "clipped" video together all throughout. In addition to this, pay close attention to the part where he talks about the fire bombing of Japan. You hear the number "100,000" but look at his lips. He didn't say it during the interview but they dubbed the audio in. It's worth rewinding and playing over again to see it. It's a shame to hear the kid at my video store in Queen Anne, Seattle, WA tell me how good this video was.
60 Compelling and Important
The Fog of War is a compelling documentary about the life of Robert McNamara (generally) and of the Vietnam War specifically. The documentary segments the film into eleven "lessons," most, unfortunately, are too banal to be accurately described as lessons. ("You can't change human nature"--no kidding.)
That said, the documentary is otherwise outstanding, comparing both McNamara's early life and its culmination as his seven years as Secretary of Defense. Not all of it would, under normal circumstances, seem to be intertwined, and yet you feel that his time at Ford at least in some way affected the later decisions made.
There are many dimensions to this film: we can see, on the base, the archived information presented in an informative, rather than dry, manner, such as the tapes from both Kennedy and Johnson. This supports with McNamara's commentary, rather than presenting nuggets of long-ago recorded conversations and work McNamara around it. McNamara himself is surprisingly lucid given his age. Alas, as the focus of the documentary, there's little in the way of competing arguments, but McNamara has been forthright in his decisions (in his book, "In Retrospect," among other forums) so he has little incentive to be elusive.
This movie, along with its eerie score, is worthy of watching by anyone--those ignorant of Cold War politics, those who lived in the turmoil of the time, and those who are slightly informed about the Vietnam War and would like to see significantly more depth without being bored. While the documentary can be a bit too proud of its own cleverness-interposing Japanese cities with American cities of comparable size along with death rates is clever, but not repeated 40 times-there's a lot more positive to it than negative.
61 Worth watching with the noted reservations
The Fog of War has received rave reviews on Amazon.com, but this review will not add to that long list. Fog is the word most appropriate for McNamara's discussion of Viet Nam. After two hours of hit and miss questions and answers, we are left with the conclusion that Viet Nam was a mistake and that McNamara was not responsible for it; that honor goes, according to McNamara, to Lyndon Johnson.
McNamara was a statistician/accountant who understood the numbers, but he was not a leader who could translate his knowledge into forceful action. Instead, it appears as if he supported Lyndon Johnson long after he realized that Viet Nam was going to be a war we could not win. Additionally, the information that he received about Viet Nam was sometimes innacurate and misleading. In hindsight he knows that it is unsafe to trust as fact reports given by subordinates. Without a historical perspective with which to judge the data he received, he arrived at false conclusions which resulted in the deaths of 58,000 Americans and millions of Vietnamese.
Not only was McNamara ignorant of history, but he also understood little about ethics. He concludes that it is morally acceptable to do evil in order to arrive at a greater good. Machiavelli, in The Prince, would certainly agree with McNamara, but The Prince should not be a handbook for American foreign policy, even though recently it appears that Machiavelli's recommendations are alive and well in American government today. Torturing and abusing Vietnamese and Iraqi prisoners may provide useful information, but few would argue that the evil of torture is justified by what we learn from it. McNamara would have done well to study Kant's Categorical Imperative. If we approve of torture, or firebombing in the example given by McNamara, we must recommend that all other nations follow our example, at least according to Kant's Imperative.
My guess is that McNamara is a much smarter man than appears to be the case in The Fog of War. Unfortuntely, the director made McNamara appear to be often confused about the facts which were his stock in trade. He is an old man reminiscing about his life in public service and his memory is conveniently selective and self-serving.
Even so, I can recommend this film with the reservations noted for this reason. No viewer will ever think again that our safety and well being as a nation depend on rationality. McNamara prided himself on being a logical man of reason and often he was. That did not stop us, according to his own testimony, of coming an eyeblink away from the apocalyse during the Cuban Missile Crisis. Luck was on our side then. After watching The Fog of War many viewers will ask: When will our luck run out? This is a question well worth asking. Hopefully some will answer that we must replace evil intentions and actions toward other countries with moral behavior that stands as an example for the world to follow. This imperative puts us on the right if not always the winning side.
62 valuable retrospective of the decisions of war
In his own words Robert Strange McNamara tells of his early life and his career, notably his service as Secretary of Defense under Presidents Kennedy and Johnson. Through his narrative, viewers obtain a unique retrospective on critical international events, including the Cuban Missile Crisis, the bombing of Japan and the Vietnam War.
McNamara sticks to the history. His personality is revealed by the way he speaks about events he found moving, but he dodges the tough personal questions, such as those about his family, his responsibility and his sense of guilt.
Clearly a reflective man, the lessons he provides are worthy of consideration by all, not just government leaders. In seeing some of the same mistakes made in current foreign relations as those McNamara recounts, viewers recognize the cycle of history, and human falliability.
63 Superb Documentary Of The Architect Of The Vietnam War!
If ever there was a modern tragedy comparable to that of poor Macbeth, it is surely that of feckless, clueless Robert McNamara, the former Secretary of Defense under Presidents Kennedy and Johnson, a man widely acknowledged to be the principal architect of the American strategy in Vietnam, the original author of policies such as body counts, a math whiz who saw the world in terms of sophisticated and elegant mathematical models. Unfortunately for McNamara and the 58,000 American boys who died in the rotting jungles of that fetid wasteland, the models failed in the real world of revolutionary zeal and little Asian guys in black pajamas, rubber flip-flops and with scruffy haircuts, who apparently never studied such methods in cutting-edge calculus and so were inexorably immune to such weighty prognostications.
It is bizarre, to say the least, then, to view this rambling monologue of twisting and winding excuses that the frail but still drop-dead intellectually gifted McNamara uses as he so frantically attempts to stamp his own brand of revisionist reinterpretations on the history of the Vietnam era and his own participation in it. Like the ghost of Iago, then, McNamara emerges from his own self-imposed splendid isolation of the last thirty years to set us all straight on what really happened back when bombs were flying and kids were dying. As the facts clearly show, he continued to support the prosecution of the war long after he knew it was a lost cause.
Certainly this is spellbinding stuff, yet anyone who is as well informed regarding the particulars McNamara slips through so effortlessly understands he is often playing fast and loose with the historical facts, and that he ignores many pieces of evidence which contradict his take on the way things unraveled. Indeed, what it appears to reduce to in the end is a brilliant but haunted man still attempting to justify, by virtue of his own considerable charm, intellect, and self-serving guile, and through painting an inaccurate and one-sided portrait of the zeitgeist of the post WWII era, his own role in the single most disastrous American war (at least until Iraq). This is an extended interview and documentary you will not want to miss. Enjoy!
64 Lessons Learned
For his award-winning documentary, "The Fog of War" - a study of the moral complexities of war and those who wage it - Errol Morris has found the perfect subject in Robert S. McNamara, the man who served as Secretary of Defense in the early days of the Vietnam War. McNamara is astute, articulate, lively and thoughtful, and as a wizened man of 85, he is able to look back on the events of his life with the kind of analytical clarity and sober-minded judgment that only old age can provide.
Wisely, Morris allows McNamara to speak for himself, providing very little in the way of poking and prodding as interviewer and filmmaker. McNamara looks at his long and varied career through the prism of eleven lessons he's learned about life and human nature. Each of these revelations is tied into a specific chapter of that career and life. We see McNamara taking stock of his actions as they relate to World War II, the Cuban Missile Crisis, and most notably, of course, the Vietnam War, in each case ruminating aloud about the moral imperatives and ethical decisions he faced on a daily basis as his crucial role in all of these events played itself out. Some may find his comments to be a bit self-serving, an attempt to whitewash the facts and minimize his own responsibility, particularly as concerns his involvement in the Vietnam War. Yet, in many instances, McNamara accepts the judgments of history and admits his culpability, even if he generally does so in a broader war-is-a-necessary-evil context. There are moments during his reminiscence when McNamara actually wells up with tears, thinking about the immense loss of life and personal tragedy that inevitably result from man's insane obsession with destroying his fellow man - while all the time acknowledging that at times wars must be fought and casualties endured for a greater cause. All throughout the film, McNamara returns to this refrain, additionally warning us that, in the nuclear age in which we live, the human propensity for warfare could very easily lead us over the precipice to global devastation and annihilation as a species. We have little reason to believe that McNamara is not being sincere in his comments, although some more cynical viewers may wonder if he isn't merely saying what he thinks he should be saying in order to secure a more favorable reputation and image for himself as his life comes to a close. If that is, indeed, the case, Morris seems blissfully unaware of it, since he basically accepts McNamara's statements at face value. As an added - and perhaps unintended bonus - much of what McNamara says has a pertinent, timely, almost prescient ring to it, as the U.S. struggles through yet another foreign engagement, this time in Iraq.
As a documentary filmmaker, Morris demonstrates his usual skill at combining archival footage with one-on-one interviews as a way of bringing his subject matter to life. The caveat here is that Morris provides no counter voices to challenge any of McNamara's statements or his interpretation of events. Yet, as McNamara relates the story of his life, a fascinating history of 20th Century American foreign policy emerges in the background. We see many of the seminal figures from McNamara's time playing out the roles history and the fates assigned to them, from John Kennedy to Lyndon Johnson to Nikita Khrushchev to a whole host of other key players on the world stage. In addition, Philip Glass and John Kusiak have provided a haunting score to go along with the haunting images.
As the title suggests, this is a complex film on a complex subject and McNamara and Morris leave us with no pat or easy answers. That is as it should be.
65 A Spellbinding Account Of Vietnam In Retrospect
"Spellbinding" is the word that comes to mind when I think of director Errol Morris's "The Fog Of War." I sat riveted for the documentary's run time, 107 minutes, and experienced a gamut of emotions as I watched former Secretary of Defense, (under Presidents Kennedy and Johnson), Robert Strange McNamara, tell his off-screen interviewer the whys and wherefores of the US War in Vietnam. Most of the film features Robert McNamara talking to the camera - no flashy post-production elements are needed. The interviewee provides more than enough drama. Mr. McNamara was one of the war's architects and he goes through all the events leading up to the escalating conflict that became "our Vietnam," giving the viewer a behind the scenes perspective. The film is annotated with some amazing archival footage and declassified White House tapes. Much of this film footage is new to me, and I have seen a fair share from this period.
I grew up in the 1960s and lost many friends and classmates in this seemingly never-ending tragedy. I watched many who survived come home maimed in body and spirit. I don't know why Robert McNamara decided to make this documentary, one of the best I have ever seen, but anyone interested in history, especially the period surrounding the Vietnam conflict, will appreciate this eye-opening account. The film may raise more questions than it answers. It does, however, provide a credible firsthand account from a man at the center of the action. Hopefully, our national leaders, past present and future will see it and benefit from it.
McNamara selected eleven lessons, (philosophical maxims), of life he believes most important, and these provide the documentary's framework. Morris succinctly chronicles McNamara's life, painting a portrait of an American giant, with such impressive credentials and intellect that President Kennedy spent some significant energy wooing him away from his job as President of the Ford Motor Company - the first non-Ford to hold that title - to become part of his cabinet. His past experience, and his ability to think and reason enabled him to quickly move into his new position as leader of the Department of Defense and major policy maker. However, as Mr. McNamara stresses in one of his lessons, "reason has its limits." One of McNamara's main themes throughout seems to be that even when dealing with intelligent, rational men, the baser parts of our nature often come to the fore. History demonstrates that apparently we don't learn from our mistakes. Morris doesn't have to specifically draw parallels to today's international situation for the similarities to be striking.
The eighty-six year old former Secretary appears to be in full command of his intellectual powers as he recounts what he learned from the Cuban missile crisis, and details some other experiences, such as his contributions to the World War II firebombing of Japan under General Curtis LeMay. He reflects on his successful work during WWII and asks, "How much evil must we do in order to do good?" He points out that, had the United States lost the war, he and LeMay would probably have been tried as war criminals. Reflecting on both Japan and Vietnam, he asks, "What makes an act immoral if you lose a war and not immoral if you win?" Of course, it is the victors who write history and determine what is justified.
Many on the political left have criticized Morris for not being "tough enough" with his questions and follow-ups. But this documentary is Mr. McNamara's story, as he sees it, in retrospect, and as he chooses to tell it. It is not an oral history, per se, it is more - the story of one man in the seat of power at a critical period in our nation's history. The focus is on Robert McNamara's integrity and beliefs and the manner in which he explains and rationalizes his part and place in history. He does accept a degree of culpability for Vietnam and for Japan. I may be overly sentimental, but I was transfixed by McNamara's expressions and emotions throughout. This is one man, I believe, who bears a heavy burden and has carried it for a long time.
Philip Glass's mesmerizing, somewhat edgy, score provides a haunting backdrop to the film. Foggy images, the ghosts of the war dead, float across the screen at various points, interspersed with McNamara's logical narrative, quoting statistics of death, percentages, numbers. Towards the documentary's conclusion, McNamara refers to the fact that "the human mind cannot comprehend all the variables" in war and finds itself overwhelmed...as if in a fog. Thus he supplies the movie's title - a phrase meaning that war involves variables too complex for the human mind to grasp.
Even if you don't usually watch documentaries, see this one. It is stunning!
JANA
66 McNamara strugle with the morality of his War actions
The Fog of War is a movie about the wars in which Robert S. McNamara played a role. First as planner of the World War II and later as part of the JFK and Johnson administration. The movie is part interviews, stemming music and war footage that support the theme of the movie that War is horror. In a way, the movie disturbs because from what Mr. McNamara is telling about the executive body. It seems to be run by quite naive people or is it Mr. McNamara that gives that impression? For example Mr. McNamara says you need to empathize with your enemy, to me that sounds as a big platitude. How else can you even think strategically? Or what to think of the fact that Mr. McNamara tries to clear his own fog of war, when he after the big conflicts, when he him self is no longer in power but his counter parts are, tries to find the truth by talking to his former opponents. Does he really think he gets answers that are context free of today's affairs? And not to mention Mr. McNamara cheap shot at saying that the US should never start a war Unilateral, clearly pointing to the war in Iraq, because Vietnam was also a Unilateral War. But what Mr. McNamara forgets to tell is that the US is not acting unilaterally in Iraq as it was in Vietnam, in Iraq the US has the support of many nations, unlike Vietnam, only not of certain former allies or of the UN.
This is a technical good movie, not mere anti war propaganda, but one that shows the horrors of war and the complexities that surround it. But most of all it shows the struggle of a former leader who wants to find Kantian certainty of morality, one he cannot find. To me this movie show the first steps for America to get in terms with the traumatic lost war in Vietnam.
67 One Tremendous Documentary.
A fascinating panorama of the twentieth century as revealed through the life of Robert McNamera. Morris uses primary source materials like old photos and taped transcripts of McNamera, Le May, Johnson, Kennedy, and Roosevelt to perfection, and this gives the film considerable power.
The film maker goes far beyond his peers in his efforts to create authenticity (such as with the man-operated, life-size, air force sortie tracking board). His stylistic touches are riveting- examples of this are the dominoes dropping across a map or egg cartons and skulls falling from atop a staircase. My favorite shot was the beautiful, forelorn depiction of President Kennedy sitting patiently and poised to speak before a camera. This is something that the viewer will never forget. The quote from Johnson saying "we don't want more war and we don't want more appeasement" will make you wince as it explains the complete absence of strategy in the Vietnam Conflict. In fact, no documentary or motion picture that I've ever seen sums up as well the causations behind the Vietnam tragedy.
What keeps me from giving this five stars is due to some serious logical leaps being present in the narration such as McNamera being sure Fidel Castro posseses a rational mind. Also, the guilt that is implied over the firebombing of Japan is tenuous without a discussion of the nature of Imperial Japan. I don't personally buy that he and Le May could be considered war criminals in light of the Japanese aggressive attack against our nation. The invader's record in China, particularly at Nanking, suggests clearly that we were fighting a just war. Certainly any of those nations occupied by Japan would agree that there was a pressing need to hurl them from the lands they ravaged.
68 Hard won Lessons A must see.
Things are not as black and white as most people
tend to see them. This will challenge your morals
and ethics. It asks hard questions. Is it necessary
to use evil to fight evil? A knee jerk response might be
no, but after seeing this film, I'm not so sure.
I think the former secretary of Defense was searching
for the answers to peace in the 21st century, and his
hard won lessons are riveting to hear about.
Anyone seeking to understand how decisions and mistakes
are make with the best of intentions at the highest levels
of government would do good to see this. I will not forget this one for a LONG time. . .
69 The Gold Standard
This film reminds us what documentaries can be. Errol Morris never gets in the way of letting Robert McNamara tell his story. Michael Moore produces films. "the Fog of War" proves Morris is a documentary master.
70 Good.
'The Fog of War' is yet another stellar film from the great documentarian Errol Morris. Moris interviews former politician Robert S. McNamara, who talks about the history of his life from 1918 to present day. Although the film has some powerful moments, it is ruined by Morris' overuse of film footage, photographs, and unnecessary filmmaking. We are constantly bombarded by five second shots of graphs, numbers, and words as they flash on and off the screen in speedy fashion. It gets annoying after a while. Worth the watch if you are interested in a powerful man's perspective on World War II and the Vietnam War.
71 Spellbound!
Unfortunately I had only the opportunity to view this film once thus far -- at the theatre. Robert MacNamara, now in his upper 80s, provides eleven lessons he has learned about war.
The Cuban Missle Crises: Years afterward, MacNamara was in Cuba visiting and met with Fidel Castro. Castro told him that he was recommending to the Soviet leadership to nuke the United States, even though Castro acknowledged that would mean the obliteration of his own county, Cuba -- and nuclear war on a vaster basis, thus we came that close to total nuclear war. As a child of ten at the time, I had no inkling how serious the situation was besides the nuclear attack exercises that we did in school -- like going under one's desk was going to improve the survival rate several miles from MacDill Air Force Base in Tampa.
The lessons are worth viewing again -- and especially worthwhile for the current administration, which clearly hasn't learned these lessons regarding war.
72 P-O-W-E-R-F-U-L!!!
To even attempt to describe this film as amazing is an understatement. It is beyond phenomenal - insofar as content, choreography, production, and so forth. The timing of the movie's release is impeccable. Given that we're in the midst of a controversial war and a presidential election, this movie couldn't have come out at a better time. A lot of food for thought in this movie, and a lot of valuable widsom shared by a public servant who lived it...
73 See this film.
This film is a great example of what a documentary really is. A previous post concluded that the films conclusions are sketchy. Well, I believe that's entirely the point. The movie is entirely through the eyes of McNamara, and it is his account of what happened. It's a primary source for pity's sake. You are forced to confront your perceptions of history.
Also, the 11 lessons are beautifully connected. The film flows along in an achingly beautiful fashion. We are confronted with the why's of some of the most difficult situations to arise in the history of man.
The Cuban Missile crisis segment is absolutely perfect. The Vietnam portion is rivetting. The ideas posed in this film are food for thought that will keep you gnawing away for days.
It's a kick in the teeth, but a good one.
74 The Best Documentary I Have Seen in 10 Years!
I came away with a much clearer understanding of McNamara and the Johnson administration. I would recommend this documentary to educators as well as to anyone interested in the Vietnam conflict. It is very much a "must see."
75 A very interesting documentary
This is an impact film narrated by McNamara; the format is that of an extended interrogation with an invisible interviewer placed behind the camera (or the tv). The film was produced beautifully with lengthy scenes of McNamara talking (at the present time as it were), pictures of battle grounds and of the dead, fast glimpses to numbers and percentages of the effectiveness of various attack methods all to symbolize - the way I see it - the inefficacy of war. Recordings of discussions between McNamara & LBJ, Kennedy and others are introduced together with historical pictures and documents.
I feel that McNamara's statements were sincere and that he was very accessible throughout the taping until he had to give yes/no responses on his share of the blame for the grave losses both sides suffered during the Vietnam war. He limits himself to stating, in the words of his interlocutor, that "you're damned if you do and damned if you don't" to which he adds "I'd rather be damned if I don't". In my opinion that on its own was a suitable answer. He stated that he has made mistakes and in the end apologized for them.
The movie covers periods between 1918 when McNamara was 2 years old and the country was celebrating the end of WWI to 1995 when he got to visit Vietnam and talk to one of his former enemies when he got to understand that what US looked at as a war of liberation the opposite camp saw as a civil war. Although he lists 11 lessons I would have added a 12th which combines two of McNamara's statements in what should be a proper advice to the current cabinet: If a majority of countries that have a similar set of beliefs as ours disagree with military action as the solution to a problem we must reevaluate the situation and in the face of misinterpretation any intelligent and able military leader will admit to making mistakes because such is the human nature: predisposed to failure.
76 Winning and Losing in the 20th and 21st Centuries
The "Fog of War" DVD, coupled with an online "Teacher's Guide" and other online resources provides an exciting, signficant, and unique learning and teaching environment suitable for anyone interested in understanding how the U.S. can win or lose in current and future conflicts. I have found these resources compelling and useful in teaching an undergraduate course in Grand Strategy to future U.S. leaders.
Harvard Professor, Industrial Chief Executive Officer, Secretary of Defense to President's Kennedy and Johnson, Robert McNamara personally guides us with a detailed and extremely well-documented look into many of the strategic decisions and personalities of the 20th century: from the systematic fire bombing of Japanese civilians during World War II by U.S. Air Force General Curtis Lemay; to decision-making by U.S. President Kennedy, Cuba's Fidel Castro, and the Soviet Union's Chairman Nikita Khrushchev during Cuban Missile Crisis that could have led to the world's first exchange of nuclear weapons; to the strategic failures by the U.S. in the planning and execution of the Vietnam War.
77 Propogana At Best
Well, it was only a matter of time when the history of WWII is re-written. This film manages to make the United States he bad guy in WWII for bombing Japan. I guess it will be forgotten that Japan attacked the U.S. first and Japan even after being beaten so badly refused to surrender until it was shown that they could be really be wiped fom the face of the earth. But according to this film the U.S. is the bad guy in WWII. Also, it is fascinating that Mr. McNamara is able to remember the end of WWI when he was 2 years old but he was not able to remember if he authorized agent orange spraying in Vitenam. Selective memory sure is convinient. Finanlly, I would like to congratulate Mr. McNamara for the fact that less than half of American soldiers died in Vietnam under his watch. For the record, approximately 58,000 American soldiers died in Vietnam. McNamara stated approximately 27,000 soldiers died under his watch. Technically it is less than half, but not by much. But really good point to emphasize Mr. McNamara.
78 Every Miltary Person, and Ideally Every Citizen, SHould View
This is the only documentary film to make it on to my list of 470+ non-fiction books relevant to national security & global issues. It is superb, and below I summarize the 11 lessons with the intent of documenting how every military person, and ideally every citizen, should view this film.
As the U.S. military goes through the motions of "transformation" while beset by the intense demands of being engaged in a 100-year war on six-fronts around the world, all of them against asymmetric threats that we do not understand and are not trained, equipped, nor organized to deal with, this film is startlingly relevant and cautionary.
LESSON 1: EMPHATHIZE WITH YOUR ENEMY. We must see ourselves as they see us, we must see their circumstances as they see them, before we can be effective.
LESSON 2: RATIONALITY WILL NOT SAVE US. Human fallibility combined with weapons of mass destruction will destroy nations. Castro has 162 nuclear warheads already on the island, and was willing to accept annihilation of Cuba as the cost of upholding his independence and honor.
LESSON 3: THERE'S SOMETHING BEYOND ONESELF. History, philosophy, values, responsibility--think beyond your niche.
LESSON 4: MAXIMIZE EFFICIENCY. Although this was McNamara's hallmark, and the fog of war demands redundancy, he has a point: we are not maximizing how we spend $500B a year toward world peace, and are instead spending it toward the enrichment of select corporations, building things that don't work in the real world.
LESSON 5: PROPORTIONALITY SHOULD BE A GUIDELINE IN WAR. McNamara is clearly still grieving over the fact that we firebombed 67 Japanese cities before we ever considered using the atomic bomb, destroying 50% to 90% of those cities.
LESSON 6: GET THE DATA. It is truly appalling to realize that the U.S. Government is operating on 2% of the relevant information, in part because it relies heavily on foreign allies for
